Ronnie Landis: Welcome to the holistic life mastery show. I’m your host, Ronnie Landis. And today we are bringing you another incredible conversation with a front runner in the psychedelic movement in the transformational space, holistic healing, and someone that I’m proud to call a brother and a very good friend and also a colleague.

His name is Sam Morris. This is the first time that Sam’s been on the show and him and I have been in a long conversation on and off about doing an episode. And finally, our schedules aligned. I had him come over to the house and we dropped in really, really deeply and this podcast recording was another good example of just trusting in the divine delays that sometimes life gives you when things don’t always go according to schedule, but they always according, they go according to plan.

That’s one of the themes of today’s episode is trusting life’s deeper plan Surrendering control letting go of the things that you can’t control and opening up to the majesty and the mastery of life And it’s innate intelligence and We go really deep right out the gate and why this episode is so special.

I think for both of us is because When we got together We both just came out of some really deep plant medicine experiences Um, this was about a weekend after I was in a two, no, actually this was a couple days. This is like two or three days. No, it’s two days after I came out of a two day weekend long ayahuasca journey, which was super deep for me.

I, I share many different. Uh, processes and lessons and experiences in it. And that weekend he actually came out of a 5meo, Bufo, Alavarius, Toad, DMT ceremony. And we both go really deep into our personal experiences and kind of trading notes and sharing. What we went through in the complimentary similarities and also opposites of these two particular medicines, um, the ayahuasca, which is mostly the DM, the NDMT, the NNDMT compound, and then the bufoalivarius toad, which is 5 MeO DMT.

The compounds aren’t so important as the actual the medicine, the spiritual intelligence of the medicine. And so if you’re really wanting to learn a lot more about plant medicines, entheogens, psychedelic, therapeutic processes, and, um, kind of this emerging field of psychonautical Um, medicine, let’s just call it.

This is a great episode to go into because not only do we talk about the medicines themselves, but we go deep into unpacking the psychological, emotional, spiritual, and also physiological processes that two, two people that are very adept in this type of exploration, this type of clinical ceremonial, and also recreational.

Um, experimentation and exploration of psychedelics and plant medicines. We both have at least 10 years plus under our belt of, of going through these type of experiences. And so I think it’s a really, really great episode for people that are both looking at it clinically, ceremonially. Um, and also looking at it.

I don’t want to use the word recreationally, but using it, um, personally for your own personal explorations in, in self administered therapeutic processes. We share a lot of our experiences. So this is a great episode to really explore, um, from, from two people that are very experienced. It’s not theoretical.

It’s not even based on research. It’s based on our own personal experience. And we’re basically just trading notes back and forth. We go into a lot of different things. We, aside from just that, you know, we get into this idea of ending the perpetual cycle of healing, Overcoming addiction. That’s a huge part of his story.

A big part of my process. I wrote a book on addiction. Obviously we talk about shifting out of the victim mentality and releasing the anxiety that is a manifestation of the victim mentality, essentially. And of course, trusting life’s master plan. So you’re going to enjoy this one. If you haven’t clicked out already, Then just buckle your seats, get ready for an amazing, amazing adventure and enjoy this episode with my dear friend, Sam Gibbs, Morris, Sam Morris.

Welcome to the show. 

Sam Morris: Thank you, brother. So great to be here. I feel like this has been a long time. 

Ronnie Landis: Yeah. Yeah. 100%. 

Sam Morris: Like from Austin to Hawaii to wherever else we’ve been traveling. Yeah. It feels super special. 

Ronnie Landis: Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. I feel the same way. And especially because the timing of this moment, um, We both just came out of some pretty deep medicine journeys this weekend.

Yes. Um, I came out of a two day ayahuasca journey and I haven’t sat in like two years. 

Sam Morris: Wow. 

Ronnie Landis: I realized that when I was going into the ceremony and I know that you did a 5meo journey, which I’m excited to hear about and the details, the experience, the intention going in and also what, what you extracted out of it, what you gained out of it.

And. Um, that’s actually a perfect lead in because I know that that’s a, that’s a significant element of the work that you do with your clients. And, um, that’s something that I’d love to illuminate for everyone listening, you know, like not necessarily what 5MEO is, Um, but like, the, your relationship with it, I think is what I’m curious about.

So I, um, yeah, leading into this kind of integration space that we’re both in. Yeah. It’s perfect. 

Sam Morris: Yeah. I feel, that’s great. And thank you so much. Um, I feel like this conversation is going to be a massive part of kind of unpacking and integrating. Because I haven’t really, I mean, it happened on Saturday, and then, you Yeah with moving and all that stuff, right?

I’ve had some time to sit down But it’s like I haven’t had a chance to like really like yeah express what yeah What really happened? So, um, where to start? Um, the intention so Um, well, maybe I should start with I’ll start with my relationship with bufo. Yeah, because that’s what kind of led me to it. So uh, my first experience with bufo was Almost four years ago to the day Last night it was december 4th, actually And, um, that’s three years ago, so 2020 and, um, the, the, the, why it’s important to say that is because that was the, I feel like that was the true start of my healing journey.

Um, you know, I, I, and to say that I hadn’t done any work before that would be completely false. Like I’ve been in this world for 15, 20 years, like just working through things, whether that’s addiction, whether that’s heartbreak or loss of parents, loss of siblings, whatever it may be. And when I smoked bufo on that day, three years ago, I didn’t realize how deep healing I needed.

I was, I was always handling like the thing in front of me. I was, you know, like, what’s in, like the depression, the anxiety, what’s right here? Like as a human, what do I know about? And that was the first time that I sat and experienced a, a level of like, of, I don’t know what I don’t know. And I feel like that’s the massive, that’s the real benefit of psychedelics.

That’s why it’s so important to do the human work, extensive human work, years of human work before you sit with psychedelics. Um, because otherwise it’s, you’re just gonna, not to say it won’t be effective, but you’ll get such a deeper experience when, when you do that. So I had been through AA for six years.

I had been through addiction and all these like therapies and rehabs and all this stuff. And on that day, I came out of it, my first thought was that was the healing that I needed every day since the day that I was born. So coming into the world I had, and it’s interesting that it was an inhalation of medicine because my big, my, uh, CPSD from growing up was these little moments, sometimes big, sometimes little, of breath.

My breath would be compromised, whether that was choking on food, whether that was a severe asthma attack, a food allergy, where the throat’s closing up. Um, you know, all my, a lot of my trauma was based around where’s my next breath going to come from. So I take, so I, on this day, when I meet Bufo, when I sit with Bufo, I take this massive in, massive breath in.

And I, and I send off and I, and I, and I get this like healing, healing, healing. And every day since the day I was born. So. Um, ever since then, pretty much right at that moment, it was, how do I bring this medicine to my clients? How do I bring this medicine to the world? And I feel like that wasn’t really my decision.

Yeah. I was available to it and open to it. And as you know, the medicine’s like, I’m with you now. And so it’s just a confluence of like decisions and choices and, uh, opening up remaining open and surrendering to the process. Yeah. And over the next nine months or so, um, that’s why I did my apprenticeship down in Mexico.

With sitting with shamans and doing you know, heroic doses and all the things that led to Facilitate this medicine now, and then i’ve done i’ve probably still taken over 200 ceremonies since then. 

Ronnie Landis: Oh, wow Yeah 

Sam Morris: with people some groups some mostly private one on one some couples some groups. Um, And so bringing me to this moment here on saturday so My mom’s dad died when she was 16 Um, and everyone in the family that’s, that has met me says I like, I resemble him physically.

I resemble him kind of emotionally and um, I’ve oftentimes before in medicine ceremonies been presented with that. I am clearing the karma of the men of my lineage. So that means my dad’s dad, who was a raging alcoholic, uh, abusive. Um, and you know, I went through that, like I cleared that. And then, um, my mom’s dad, who, he was a doctor in Cooperstown, New York, and, um, I don’t know much but I know that there’s some whispers that there were some things happening That were maybe not of the utmost integrity and so like so for me like he’s come to me in several medicine ceremonies um And this again, this is about like, I don’t know what I don’t know Yeah, my intention in this ceremony and i’ll get back to that in a second.

My intention in this ceremony was Um this year has been about like sitting with medicines. It’s not so much of a healing journey anymore It’s like an expansion journey Mm-Hmm. , you know, like Mm-Hmm. . These medicines provide me with so much healing, like, like the healing I needed ever since today I was born literally.

Right. Right. And now it’s been like, you know, I think the tendency is to go in and say like, oh, I got all this stuff to heal. Yep. And yes, there, it’s there, but you get to a certain point where it’s like, okay, so I’m at this like, brand new baseline and I’m, I’m of the light now, not so much of the darkness anymore.

Mm-Hmm. . Mm-Hmm. . And I feel like I got there this year and so this medicine journey was the first one where I said. You know, I’m calling in expansion. I’m calling in wealth. I’m calling in clients I’m calling in like bigger impact and all these these things that I’m desiring to bring to the world Yeah, as opposed to what can you do for me?

Right? How can I be of service now? Mm hmm and so that was my big intention going in and I had a whole list and I wrote a letter to myself my future self and did the whole intention thing and All that all that came in on that intention was Yes, it’s already here. It’s here. You’re doing it like they’re this is this is why you’re you you have landed in the exact place That you’re supposed to be in men’s work in psychedelic leadership in yogic leadership Like all these things like it has you are here.

Mm hmm. And so it was a comfortable a really grounded like Precise confirmation of like this is it like you you already know. Well, yeah, and so Coming back to the grandfather thing um So he died 16. The way he died was that he was mowing the back lawn and he ran over an in ground beehive and, and like five or 600 bees came up and swarmed him and stung him and he died of anaphylaxis.

Yeah. So I do my first inhale. Um, I did three rounds of the Bufo and I did my first one and towards the end as I was kind of coming back and I was kind of like, you know, in that, like. I’m not out of the medicine, but I’m also present enough. I just felt like I made a beeline for the backyard. I think emotional.

Um, So maybe like for backyard and as I was going out of the backyard, I was like, all my, I took off all my clothes. I was like, I need to like, I need to feel this land, the community, this land, and I’ll get to the importance of the, of that house in a second. Um, and then after the fact, so I went out there and I did, I did two more than a second, two rounds out there in the backyard.

And, um, The, the, my buddy that was holding space for me told me yesterday, he was like, Yeah, as soon as you came out and laid on the ground, a swarm of bees flew up out of the ground. Like, right kind of by you where you were lying, yeah. And so I was like, and so as, when he said that, I immediately thought of my grandfather.

And like, holy shit, like, this is like, The completion of that karmic healing like i’m done healing that This goes back to me now Like it’s time for me to like step into expansion and not be so weighted down by all this healing and bad karma Ancestral trauma There’s like I completed it with my dad’s dad With the addiction and healing from that and now I completed it with what was going on with my mom’s dad By essentially coming home to myself Yeah, and so then he dotted these things and the bees flew up out of the ground like right next to where I was laying down And I was just I kind of collapsed at that moment.

I was like, holy shit. Like I thought I knew how important this house was and this land was, but then I was like, Everything led me to like that moment 

Ronnie Landis: and bees coming up out of the ground. Yeah That is not normal. No. 

Sam Morris: It’s only the second time I’ve ever heard of bees being in the ground. Right. Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

The first time was, you know, when my mom was 16 back in 1953 or whatever it was. Wow. Yeah. Wow. So, that was, that was kind of the big, the big experience of the, of the Bufo. And then also, um, I, I’ve landed this year on, you know, So the hero’s journey, we talked about, you know, everyone talks about like, okay, event happens, addiction.

You get set off onto the, onto the hero’s journey and you go and you slay your dragons and conquering your demons and facing down the monsters and all the things that happen out there. And what always, and what happens is that it feels so good to do that. Yeah. It’s like, we get, as men I think, mostly like, women I’m sure too, but I’ll speak to men.

Is that. That warrior in us comes online and it’s like this is my purpose to be a warrior And okay. Yes But if you’re always remaining on the hero’s journey, you’re going to start creating dragons and creating It looks like self sabotage and it looks like right, you know Running away isolating disconnecting like all these things because it feels so good and worthy And like we’re doing what we’re supposed to be doing And the part that gets lost is is come back home 

the 

return home from the hero’s journey, 

Ronnie Landis: right?

Sam Morris: And so Um, you know, I’ve been on a hero’s journey essentially for like 20 years since I, since I got divorced, you know, 18 years. Um, I was, you know, my marriage ended and that’s when the, all the, like the real addiction started to kick on. And, um, so I’ve been living in these like studio and one bedroom kind of cubbyhole apartments for 18, 20 years.

Wow. Yeah. And I had a brief stint in a house in North Carolina. And that was when the addiction actually ended, was at that house. Oh, interesting. But it was like two months, but it was too expensive for me. Oh, okay. And, and so now, 11 years later, I have another opportunity to like, expand again into a house with like a holy body and new consciousness.

But, so this house signifies this coming home. Mm hmm. And then to have, you know, my, basically my grandfather’s presence there and on the land. It’s just like, there’s so many things aligned and just like falling into place. It’s that ceremony. It was just, it was confirmation of, okay, exactly where we were supposed to be.

Ronnie Landis: Wow. Yeah. Wow. That’s, that’s incredible. That is an incredible story. Yeah. There’s so many pieces to it. 

Sam Morris: Yeah. 

Ronnie Landis: What, um, for people that don’t know, like what, what would you say differentiates. Bufo, 5 MeO, DMT from, you know, ayahuasca or psilocybin or MDMA or iboga. We don’t have to get into, into all those things, but in the vast category of psychedelics or mind altering substances and theogens, like, um, is it, there’s a lot to Bufo.

That’s not, um, it’s very nuanced, I think, especially for someone like you who is a seasoned practitioner and facilitator Versus someone like even like me who’s done maybe 10 bufo sessions Um, and I have my own experience with them. Um, none of them bad But just none of them like the same as like going through an ayahuasca journey Like to me me going through ayahuasca is like a pinnacle experience That um, I don’t get from bufo or at least I haven’t so far So I’m just curious.

Yeah. Like what, what, what makes it so unique or special for you? 

Sam Morris: Um, I think, so for me it’s, it’s a surrender piece. 

Ronnie Landis: Yeah. That’s the big, it’s a huge part of it. 

Sam Morris: And I think like, if we want to get into like a, kind of a 3d difference, it’s the time, you know, all the other ones are basically six to 24 hours.

You’re talking about a bit of a peyote. Yeah. And so this one is 20 minutes, literally 15 to 20 minutes. And so it’s, it’s, it’s one of those where it’s like, how much can you like people, you know, the mind wants to get around like, Oh, but I need eight hours in this and this then speaks to like, let’s not getting into even comparing these to totally, yeah, let’s like, let’s allow them to be with each one is because I feel like Bufo is the most somatic, 

Ronnie Landis: the most somatic of 

Sam Morris: medicines because, um, there’s essentially no time to purge.

And with 

ayahuasca. 

You have like you’re in there for nine hours Oh, yeah, you’re gonna go through the stomach and there’s so many 

Ronnie Landis: reverberations And once you complete one cycle, you’re off into another journey and it’s like yeah, and it is I just want to comment on this too because this happened for me in the journey where Both nights the onset was really intense and Even points kind of frightening like just in the from the ego perspective of like i’m in a i’m in a bind That doesn’t make any sense But i’m in this like energetic bind and there’s all these visuals coming in And I can’t I can’t get out 

Sam Morris: Yeah, 

Ronnie Landis: so it’s like if I was there for 15 minutes and I knew that somewhere it would be it’s a different level of surrender To just being in this like Bind wrapped around vines.

Yeah, and just stuck, right? It’s like, oh my god, when is this gonna break out? But then on the other end when I did emerge out of it, there was a sense of like such relief and gratitude 

Sam Morris: Yes, 

Ronnie Landis: because of the time extension 

Sam Morris: 100 percent sure. Yeah These being, they’re being so long lasting. That’s exactly it.

Like, we go through, like, these moments where, like, I’m fully in my human. Like, I’m here and I’m aware that I’m fucking scared as shit. And this ayahuasca is, like, coming like a freight train and I can see it. And I know that for the next seven hours, what’s gonna happen? And, and then, and within that seven hours, there’s, like, those moments where it’s like, okay.

I’m, like, writhing around on the ground or throwing up or going to the bathroom or whatever it is. And then the human comes kind of, the human comes back and you’re like, okay, a little bit of a lull. Right. And it’s like, woof, you’re back in it again. Yeah, yeah. With, with Bufo, it’s, like, I always say, like, you know, with the other ones, there’s an arc to it.

Mmm. Like, you know, you drink, or you eat the mushrooms, or take the LSD, or whatever it is. And then, you know, you have about 30 or 45 minutes of, like, a lead up. Mmm. And then you start to feel it, and then you’re kind of in it. Whatever six to ten hours, and then you fade out whereas Bufo is more of like a literal blast off Yeah, you’re straight up.

Like there’s no you’re right by the time you’re done inhaling you’re are you’re it’s hit you You know, it’s real fast and then it’s the the taper off So the arc is still there, but it’s almost like the half of the arc Like you just go right in the middle of it and then you taper off. And so I think that Bufo The Surrender piece is that, um, people want that experience of like the remembrance and the knowing, which is a hundred percent valuable, and like I think this is why the longer, the longer, um, titrated medicines like actually serve purpose, because people do get this experience of being in there eight hours.

But with bufo, a lot of times, there’s, There’s some very little remembrance, right? You know, and so that’s, and especially in the first few minutes when you’re completely blasted off and disassociated and the mind and the body are operating separately and you’re, you know, you’re like the, the line of consciousness is like a dot in the rear view mirror, right?

He’s just in it, right? Well, you’re in source, you know, where it’s all, all knowing, all being you’re fully like 

Ronnie Landis: merged, 

Sam Morris: fully merged with everything. Like there is no separation at all. 

And 

so people come out and like, what happened? Like I want to know and like it doesn’t matter. Yeah, I don’t Like so they say it’s 15 15 years of therapy in 15 minutes.

I like to say it’s 15 lifetimes Because it’s the seven generations back the seven forward and the one that you’re experiencing now and so people This is and this is when that like the shaking and moving around and somatic 

Ronnie Landis: catharsis and complete somatic 

Sam Morris: release because finally the mind Is completely out of the game It’s there of course, but like the body is finally free to express and release what it’s wanting to Express and release for so for so long that again, what did I not know?

What was I holding in my hips? What was I holding in my shoulders? I mean, I’ve seen people go into full on like Boat pose and just hold it and just like, it’s completely flexed and just relax. Uh, 

Ronnie Landis: yeah. 

Sam Morris: Yeah. And so the big difference is that like, although it is 15, 20 minutes, you get so much work, so much work.

It’s done by the medicine itself. Like there’s not like with ayahuasca, you’re kind of like, and mushrooms too. There’s like an element of. You and the medicine are working together to work through this thing. Mm-Hmm. . And that feels good to a human. ’cause it feels like we’re doing something which is a Right, right.

Like a worth thing for human beings. Mm-Hmm. . And so with Bufo, it’s like you just literally have to let the medicine do what it’s gonna do and the medicine will, it’s, it’s the only one I feel that completely takes the hands off the wheel. 

Ronnie Landis: Okay. Completely. Yeah. I, I see, I can see that. Yeah. Yeah. Ayahuasca kind of like.

It’s kind of um, I don’t want to say like it forces you because you can resist. Yeah, you’re fully capable of resisting. It’s just But you’re not going to overpower this thing You’re not you’re not going to outsmart it or outwit it like It has your no it has your number. It’s got you checkmated in every single Every single 

Sam Morris: move and she’ll listen to you.

She’ll be you’ll be like, I don’t want to go there. She’s like, okay We’ll just put that one on the deck circle. I’ll consider that. I always say, there’s a meme out there that, uh, it’s actually a set, like a proverb, but it’s, uh, when you’re wrestling an 800 pound gorilla, you’re not done when, the match isn’t over when you’re done, the match is over when the gorilla’s done.

That gorilla is ayahuasca. Totally. You’re not, it’s not about, like, I’ve gotten to the end of ayahuasca ceremonies and you’re It’s still, it’s still here, it’s still going through. Oh yeah, oh yeah, oh yeah. And the one in, uh, the last time I sat in Costa Rica, not last time, but the time before last time I sat in Costa Rica, I was in the most fucking intense, like, I don’t even know how long it was, but it was my fourth cup.

And it was like, it was the tail end of the ceremony, so probably three hours. It was the most intense to the point where I was in and out, like he’s talking about, like, in this, like, intense, like, experiencing all my shame and all my guilt and all my Just the things I hate about myself and then it’ll be like a release and it’ll be like complete god consciousness And then it would come back I kept I got to the point where I was saying like kind of out loud.

God, damn it. It can just be done and it kept coming and then I towards the end I started saying I was like, you know, god damn it doesn’t feel right anymore. I said god. I said god. Thank you 

Ronnie Landis: Uh huh, and then it changed. Yeah, totally it was over 

Sam Morris: like it was just done And like that shift of that that’s the surrender there like you said like you can say like, okay, no But then she’s gonna be like why are you resisting?

Okay, you don’t want to look at that but we’re going to look at something else that’s related to that And the resistance is futile 

Ronnie Landis: And it shows you it shows you all the areas that you are resisting or you have the propensity to resist. Yes and I mean it’s like infinite in terms of what we could describe and go into just and that’s the thing with like You The ayahuasca experience is that it’s infinite, but it takes you through Infinity like movie scenes that you’re psychosomatically experiencing and going through and navigating Yeah, which is I think that that’s one of the one of the main differences They’re they’re very similar on some level but in the experience very very different 

Sam Morris: Yeah, 

Ronnie Landis: but there is like a similar signature in a way Right because you’re like going with bufo.

You’re going You From infinity and beyond like right out the gate. Yeah with aya. It’s it’s a progressive quest Like i’m literally going through a quest and I think that’s what I enjoy about it. Yeah, is that I like to go through this journey and this experience. And there’s parts of it where I’m like, Oh God, I should not, I shouldn’t have drank in that last cup.

And I’m, I’m, I don’t know if I want to ever do this again. And then I come through. And then it’s like a deep, profound rapturous moment where like, Every bit of me comes into synchrony, and I’m having this deep cathartic reconnection with myself. And it’s beyond description, but then I’m like feeling like I’m in the, the release and the embers of my subconscious trauma or whatever is being released and brought back into the, into the, the ethers.

And it’s like, there feels like there’s this. Spirit that is that is wafting me with everything that I’ve held for so long and just these moments of absolute relief and Remembrance. Yes, and then as I come out of that and I’m ready to like sit with it Then the music shifts and then it goes into tribal beats and I’m like Cuz I’m like no, can we just stay with what just happened?

Can I just stay with this like profound? And Deep healing and then And then it’s like oh and then you feel like oh here comes the snakes i’m like, oh man And so it’s like I thought I was out out of it and I just come cross through and now it’s like Oh, no now i’m gonna now I have to release my resistance to to that now 

Sam Morris: you’re right And and the medicine the medicine is so intelligent You wanted to hold on to that experience, but she’s like no you’re complete there And you’re like, but it was so nice.

It was so beautiful. Yeah. She’s like, well, here we go. 

Ronnie Landis: Let me ask you. So you said, um, with bufo or any other medicines, but bufo in particular, it’s like doing 15 lifetimes. What do you mean by that? Because I, it’s. You know, again, to the distinction between these two, like Aya, it’s drawn out, the mind can wrap its head around what that means, ten years of psychotherapy in a single session or two, like that, okay, yeah, I can totally make that sense because I’m, I’m, I’m co piloting, I’m co I’m in the, the thing of it, like with, with Bufo, Do you mean like it’s energetically?

Cause I can’t, I can’t recapture that. I don’t know that that’s true after I come out of it. Yeah. I know that there’s a shift. Yeah. Yeah. 

Sam Morris: And so, I think Bufo, um, is, is the quantum. It operates in the quantum. Mm, mm hmm. And when we talk about quantum healing, We literally, we go seven generations back. That’s how deep the quantum goes.

And seven generations forward. So as quantum, there’s like multiple timelines existing all at one time. So your future self is already happening, and your past self, and all the souls in the lifetimes that you’ve lived, and all that stuff. So, when you sit with these medicines, and I mean, I think all of them, but especially Bufo, you’re literally repatterning the seven years, the seven generations coming up, and And therefore the seven generations that get to exist in, you know, if we want to talk 3d for the next thousand years, but in the quantum, like you’re, it’s a literal, like putting a hand forward and touching all these other versions of you that are future versions of you that are existing right now and healing in those lifetimes and so.

When we, when we talk about, like, and that’s what the one that’s happening now, because you’re the one that’s ingesting the medicine now. Mmm. You’re obviously, you’re clearly going to get some relief and some healing, because you’re not carrying these burdens anymore. Mmm. You know, the epigenetics of it, the burdens of the stories of your lineage, or the stories of these karmic contracts that you signed.

Right. And then the burdens of, um, you know, the weight of, like, those karmic contracts shifting and continuing forward, all of it gets released, and you feel in this lifetime now, Mmm. Back to the, this, this world, this version is this version of me to this immense relief because there’s so much freedom in the body and so much freedom in the, um, just the healing.

I remember like there was a, like my anxiety, like voices in the head, it was like volume 500 before I spoke Bufo. And I remember sitting in meditation like three days later and I like, I’ve been meditating for 15 years and I’m like, I’ve never, I’ve never meditated before, like I’ve never actually meditated before because it was always just.

Essentially like rapid fire voices in my head and then I was like sitting there It’s like three days later and I was like it is really fun. Wow. Yeah And then the voice is like I mean the anxiety is there it’s it’s it exists, but it’s like if it was 500 It’s like 50 25 volume Sometimes it’s a three and so and that’s never it’s never Been back to that level.

It was before that info and then with ayahuasca Experience you’re talking about of like being in this like realm. Yeah. So these, these like thoughts that I have, like my, I can tell I talk fast, but my thoughts are like, you know, and so when I was, there was a moment in Ayahuasca, it was the first time I sat, I was in the Amazon and I landed in this place that was like, you know, Lars Pullman, those like, it’s like AI art.

Yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I was in like that kind of place I’ve been, I 

Ronnie Landis: know exactly what you’re talking about. Yeah. Yep. 

Sam Morris: And there was like a tribunal of all these versions of me around me. Whoa. And I was sitting there like trying to make space for all these different thoughts and like, oh no. Like it was so, it felt so like overwhelming and chaotic.

And all of a sudden, like, all these thoughts just got to exist on this, like, I was sitting on this, like, blue water. And, like, everything calmed down. And, like, oh, they just all get to be here. Like, there’s no, there’s space enough for all of them. And it was another one of these, like, quieting of this chaos, this internal chaos.

Which, this now, like, getting into, like, divine masculinity, like, this is what creates the space in our society. Like, this is when we, when we don’t have this bandwidth, like, just jacked up by thoughts and anxiety and voices and noises and beliefs and all that, and we have clear, like, ability to hold it all, that’s when we can be present.

If we’re, if we’re, if we’re, like, if we’re sitting, if you’re sitting with your girlfriend and I’m sitting with, You know partner anybody and you’re you can be there and pretend you’re listening and maybe you’re half listening But if you got things raced around your head, you’re not really there and she can feel that And that’s where the trust erodes and safety erodes and all that stuff.

Ronnie Landis: Totally totally. I mean, that’s so much of what my What I was navigating in my journey, you know, like like exactly that and that’s what i’ve noticed with aya but in particular this experience like it it It’s partly, like, deeply trying to experience the experience, and then also being completely distracted by the mind in its, like, narrativizing, and describing, and analyzing, and also coming in to, like, to, like, try to explain.

To itself what’s happening and it was so Just agitating. 

Sam Morris: Yeah, 

Ronnie Landis: you know what I mean? Like I’ve talked to a number of people that have had this experience too So it wasn’t just me But it was like, okay, like i’m having the experience that I could actually deal with the experience As whatever it is. Yeah, but then the mind coming in trying to like explain It like make sense of it.

Yeah, like make sense of it. But it’s like it’s it’s like You It’s audible. It’s like, it’s, it’s, it’s, it’s going, it’s, so it’s like distracting from the experience. And I can’t, it’s like, I can’t shut it off. So it’s what we were talking about before we recorded is like this sometimes like this, this amplification, this magnification of.

Subconscious thoughts or stories or beliefs or self judgments and then being turned up to a hundred yeah in a way that we don’t experience in our waking state and Experiencing the um, the energetic impact that that has on the system like just being cranked up Yeah, and one piece without going too deep into it, but just one piece I really was challenged by in the first night and going through this deep like wave of grief and just all these like self Criticisms, but it’s hard to differentiate between self judgment and authentic accountability.

It was not clear to me, actually, if one was different than the other. Because there’s all these things going through, and I really was like, Oh my god, like, you’re so dropping the ball in these certain areas, and you’re not showing up, and da da da da, all this. And it felt super authentic, like, like this feeling of like, I need to step up and I need to be better and I need to take accountability for this.

And then, but it was so full on that it got to a point where I was like, man, this is really harsh. Like, this is really like, like, Like this has got to be some sort of deeper self judgment and like as I came out of it I realized like okay, like I see the medicine in it. 

Sam Morris: Yeah, 

Ronnie Landis: and I also see how Unnecessarily hard I can be on myself, but it just amplified that 

Sam Morris: yeah, 

Ronnie Landis: this is not something I walk around with all the time Sometimes I’ll feel it like oh, you know if something happens or get a reflection But in this case it just like drove it up 

Sam Morris: Yeah, I um, thanks for sharing that because it it’s so relatable because Well, I think aside from like whatever the event was, right?

I’m falling short. Right, right I’m fucking up over here. The the real root of that is this harsh self judgment. 

Ronnie Landis: Yes 

Sam Morris: And so that’s what the ayahuasca was showing you. I feel like yeah, no, that’s agreed it’s It’s not because these things are going to happen in life Then you come back to yourself the next day or whenever and you’re like, well, thank you and like, okay In my real human experience, which is also very important, it doesn’t feel like that big of a deal.

Yeah. But what does feel, what I do need to know is that I am excruciatingly hard on myself. Yes. And what hap, I think, I think what these medicines show us is they, so this 95 percent that’s subconscious that operates and drives most of our life. That’s where we, that’s where we go in. Yeah. With medicines.

And that’s why they’re so important because like, You you as a human are like, okay, it’s there You’re like, okay, I get that. I’m a little hard on myself. Yeah, ayahuasca is like no, no, bro. Like you are really You you really use a little backing off on that and that’s where the kindness of ayahuasca like she’s just she’s showing you You know in a very intense way Where you get to be a little nicer or where you get to be a little more conscious Yeah, and so I think that and that’s what’s so scary is that because that 95 that we never hear You But yet drives the show we we either two things happen Well, I feel like one is is like and these it’s not either but they both happened like but we literally associate consciousness as a line The five percent and 95 and most of the time we’re you know in the five percent where we’re aware And that 95 kind of surrounds us With these medicines what happens is like we have one foot in the conscious and one foot in the subconscious and we’re literally straddling line Yep, and we get to truly see how does this self judgment affect?

My 5 percent and that’s and then then then we get into integration like okay great Like you said it like ownership awareness self awareness, right? All very valuable and when do we get heavy handed with it too much right too much self awareness It actually blocks us from showing up, 

Ronnie Landis: right? Exactly Yeah, and the the manifestation of anxiety and these different, you know psychological and in physiological Psychological symptoms that you know, our world is so quick to You know, a pill for every ill and cut, burn poison and, and take this supplement and this biohacking thing.

And, and a lot of it is great, but most of it is symptom management, even the holistic health world and the naturopathic world and the, the IV injections and even like the sauna and cold plunging and the floating, like it’s all great stuff, but primarily symptom management in the way that. Most people are dealing with it, not because they’re dealing with it incorrectly, but because they’re dealing with, you know, low to medium to high grade anxiety.

Whether you know it or not, it’s just the dysregulation of our somatic system and everything that you’re talking about. Like these, these unresolved Echoes that are in the backdrop of our subconscious mind. But the body keeps the score, as we know. 

Sam Morris: Yes. 

Ronnie Landis: Yeah. 

Sam Morris: Yeah, it’s, it’s so true. And, and then, you know, anxiety is like, it’s, it’s a symptom of inflammation.

So, you know, so like we have like, whatever’s going on in our body. And like you said, like, there, Like we don’t go get an IV unless we’re hungover or unless we’re like the allergies are really bad, right? And it’s like in this is like, I don’t know if you know a german new medicine. Yeah Like this is um, it’s really attractive to me because it like really just blows past symptoms 

Ronnie Landis: And I asked my friend, you know, brandon bozar.

Yeah. He’s a yeah, very close friend of mine. Yeah. Yeah He’s a 

Sam Morris: good friend of mine, too And I asked him I was like, what what does german medicine say about food allergen? He’s like brother doesn’t exist I’m, like what he’s like. Yeah, it’s all it’s all a trauma marker you That you develop some sort of protection mechanism when something happens.

But, literally, like, food allergies, there’s nothing in German medicine that says food allergies should be a thing. 

Ronnie Landis: Yeah. 

Sam Morris: And so that’s, I completely agree with that. Yeah. Like symptoms, if we can look past this, if we treat the symptoms, we’re essentially, that’s when the body starts keeping the score. Mm hmm.

Mm hmm. You treat the symptoms and the body’s like, I guess I don’t matter. It’s like, bro, I’m trying to tell you something and you’re like, no, I’ll take it. 

Ronnie Landis: Yeah, that, that’s a, that is a key point. That’s a key point. Even with food allergies, like really what it is, the immune system’s compromised. It’s not that you’re fundamentally, um, allergic to something, but there has, there has been a development of a signature.

It’s like a cellular signature that is associated. the tobacco as, you know, something that agitates your system. So then there’s a histamine reaction. But then again, it’s like, but then the deeper thing is like, what is the energetic that you have have, um, consistently developed with the tobacco? Yeah, escapism stress management, you know, now there’s an addictive component to it instead of like more of a ceremonial or once in a while kind of thing Then it then it develops this like this signature and then that actually becomes detrimental to the immune system And so, like, just on a physiological level, that, I believe that is totally true.

Yeah. And I can see how that, how that just, how that’s true with most things. 

Sam Morris: Right. Yeah. And to take that even a step further is like, okay, so you recognize that tobacco is an agitator. Yeah. And it gives you an allergic reaction, essentially. Mm hmm. Why, why do you keep choosing allergic reactions? Do you like being a victim?

Do you want a little sympathy? Like, what’s going on there? Like, when, when, when did it become, when did allergic reactions become serviceable to you? Interesting. At what point did, at what point did you get benefit or payoff from allergic reaction? Like, for me, from asthma. Like, I got so much payoff as a kid from these things.

Like, attention and validation and sympathy. You could miss school. You could miss school. Yeah. I would, I’d be able to go to the hospital and like, and they had cable TV at the hospital and like, I didn’t have that at home and there was like just so much and so Taking that with me through life. I recognized it like oh This state of struggle, or victimhood, actually, like, there’s payoffs, like, that’s addiction.

Like, I, I was like, my life was really fucking good before addiction. I was, I got married, I had fine houses, I had a great job. I’m like, this is, it doesn’t feel, I don’t feel good in this. Because there’s no, there’s no space for my victim. Wow. There’s no space, like, I feel like I’m not getting the attention I would get if I was struggling with something.

And so, enter addiction. 

Ronnie Landis: Wow. 

Sam Morris: And, uh, back to the um, Food allergy thing. Yeah, 

Ronnie Landis: yeah. 

Sam Morris: Um, people with multiple personality disorders. Well, they have like three, four, five different personalities. 

Ronnie Landis: Mm hmm. 

Sam Morris: They’ve done studies in like one of the personalities will have a severe peanut allergy and the other four will not.

Yep, 

Ronnie Landis: I’ve actually studied this. Funny you bring it up. Oh, yeah, 

Sam Morris: tell me what you know. Well, no, just that 

Ronnie Landis: basic premise that you just mentioned. Like somebody, I’ve studied it particularly with like disease reversal and spontaneous remissions. Mm hmm. I’ve also seen the, the food allergies Um, piece of it too, but like somebody that has cancer, stage three or stage four cancer, and they have like a, they have, um, an identity shift.

Like, so like literally just. An identity shift not necessarily even multiple personality syndrome But they have just have a fundamental shift in their identity and then over a certain amount of time I suspect and then they the Manifestation of those symptoms completely disappeared because it wasn’t associated to the new identity But then I i’m also backtracking through Just research or studying random things like this where that also has been the case In multiple personality syndrome where somebody Yeah, they have whatever going on, but then they click over into this other, this other version of themself that doesn’t have those symptoms, doesn’t have those personality traits, doesn’t have those mannerisms.

Yeah. A whole different identity. 

Sam Morris: Right. Yeah. It’s like, they did a study on cigarette smokers, like 60 people that smoke cigarettes, and they told 30 of them, say, when someone asks you, like, no, I’m trying to quit. And then the other 30 that said, no, I don’t smoke was going to be the response. 

Ronnie Landis: Yup. 

Sam Morris: And the people that said, no, I don’t smoke, like the, the, the rate of success was like a thousand times more because they just said, no, I identify as a non smoker where the other person still identified as a smoker that’s trying to quit.

That’s trying to quit. Yeah. Right. And so they’re still stuck in the identity. It’s, it’s, this is why I left Alcoholics Anonymous because every morning, every meeting you go to, I’m saying I’m an alcoholic. If you don’t say it, they’re like, what’s going on over there? Not an alcoholic and yeah, they like question you about it ‘

Ronnie Landis: cause they don’t believe you.

Like, you’re always gonna be a recovering alcoholic. It 

Sam Morris: doesn’t fit their 

Ronnie Landis: narrative 

Sam Morris: uhhuh because them, they, they feel the need to identify as an alcoholic so it stays present in their system. So they’re like, it’s an awareness thing. For me though, it felt like if I got to the point where like if I’m always identifying myself as an alcoholic, to me that meant that I’m also identifying, identifying myself as a broken human being.

Ronnie Landis: Right, right. Always gonna 

Sam Morris: have something to fix. And that, that, so me leaving AA was like the most, probably the most important, the most potent medicine that I ever experienced in my journey was that moment when I decided I’m leaving AA, I’m going to go on this other journey. It was, I mean, I was, I was on an upward trajectory, but it was a hockey stick moment.

Ronnie Landis: Wow. Because I, 

Sam Morris: because I shifted the identity. 

Ronnie Landis: Mm hmm. You no longer needed the meetings. 

Sam Morris: I don’t, I don’t even feel, I don’t even, like, even the conversation about, you know, Alcoholic or sobriety or recovery? Like it doesn’t really it’s not i’ll have the conversation and I understand it and it serves a lot of people Naa served me for a very long time.

No shade and Like that conversation doesn’t resonate with me anymore. 

Ronnie Landis: Yeah, 

Sam Morris: and it’s it’s it’s So in a there’s a thing about i’m recovering. Yep, or i’m recovered And there’s a big there’s a kind of like a big battle about it Like if you say i’m recovering people are going to question you but like because you always Again, always recovering, right?

When are you 

Ronnie Landis: gonna when are you gonna like and that’s a perpetual i’m healing i’m growing It’s it’s like it’s a never ending loop 

Sam Morris: Yes, and this goes back to being out on the hero’s journey Like you’re always always just creating a reason to fight to stay out there because that’s so because really What what’s back home either represents too much pain or you feel like you can’t handle it or you don’t deserve that life You don’t deserve that.

Yeah. Yeah, like the beautiful woman the beautiful life and like a guy like He’ll live at the house, with his wife, and he’s not really home. Because he’s not home for himself. He’s still looking for battles to fight. Yeah. Yeah. And so, it’s, it just, like, the more that we can, again, like, look at these, like, What are we, what are we doing to identify ourself, or how are we identifying ourselves?

Yeah. As, like, as the The the struggle guy or is it the the expansion or the um, The balanced grounded guy because we can’t right. 

Ronnie Landis: No, that’s true. Yeah, that’s very true. Yeah. Yeah, you can’t you can’t be Uh can is a strong word. I it’s let’s just say it’s challenging To be fully stable and fully grounded and also to be ever continually expanding And even as I say that I I am getting a kind of a picture of like this This holy trinity kind of perspective versus this this like dualistic perspective of like it’s one or the other Yeah I also see that there is this image of like being rooted and grounded like with your feet on the ground Mm hmm, and then you’re also able to expand and widen with like your head in the clouds, so to speak Yeah, like the bridging between heaven and earth.

Yes, but then there’s a third prong to that which is Has to be spirit or God and I think that’s the foot that that that’s like that That’s the difference maker right is when people are really strong in their faith And they, they’re beyond themself. Like, that’s like, that’s what I think is the difference between recovered and recovering.

If I’m always recovering, I, I’m the one who thinks I’m in charge. I’m the one who’s doing everything. I’m trying to make everything happen, right? I’m recovering versus like, I’m recovered, meaning I have recovered something within me that was lost, right? And so what else could that be other than a connection with?

God source spirit divine divinity and the earth. Yeah, right. 

Sam Morris: And then be that, be that kind of channel, that vessel, then that’s what when we talk about divine masculine, that’s what that is. It’s that connected, grounded, safe. And also like how, how tapped in to source and how much of a mess, a messenger, a vessel of source in mind.

And then that, I think that third part you talk about is that meeting of it 

is 

like, is the, the 360 awareness. Uh 

Ronnie Landis: huh, uh huh. Because within 

Sam Morris: that, like, tapped in up here, grounded down here, like, you have this world in front of you that you have to be present to. Mm hmm. And if you’re not, you’re missing the boat big time.

You’re missing the boat. Yeah. Yeah. Because, I mean, it’s easy to say, like, oh, I’m, I experienced this earlier this year where, like, coming out of addiction, um, it’s a very ungrounded experience. You know chaotic existence like you’re you’re fucking all over the place and so like my my my kind Reflex was the pendulum swung.

So funny direction. I was like Grounded down and safe to the point where it was like I got feedback that like it’s kind of boring and robotic. 

Ronnie Landis: Yeah. Yeah. Like well, I’m a very boring person. Yeah 

Sam Morris: I did I recognized it like and and like I would I would tell stories about like drunk sam and people Where’s that guy?

Like you don’t have to be drunk to have that level of like expression Joy, and I I had associated it with shame and uh guilt from the addiction And so this whole year has been really about like, how do I get off the ground a little bit? Back into like the source and also present to the pleasure and the joy of life.

Ronnie Landis: Yeah. 

Sam Morris: Which is just the most massive growth I’ve ever experienced. 

Ronnie Landis: Did, um, that process, did, did the, the breakup from the relationship, did that facilitate that? 

Sam Morris: I would say the breakup, yes, but also the kind of the end of it. 

Ronnie Landis: The actual completion. Yeah, like 

Sam Morris: the way that I was showing up in the end of it was, It was not great.

Okay. I was, I, I, I went from, you know, okay, maybe I was safe and granted, but I was also like, I got to the point where I was completely checked out. 

Ronnie Landis: Yeah. And then 

Sam Morris: she, she experienced abandonment from, from my, from how I was showing up or not showing up, which is true. Like I, I did not. And it was, there was abandonment there.

And I, I mean, Medicine for everybody. 

Ronnie Landis: Yeah, and 

Sam Morris: I It pointed me in the direction of wow You got fucking work to do you got work to do in your masculine frame like who you who you show up as a man? Cuz I can be on Instagram and coach guys and tell them give them all the things to do to like be that and I was Not it.

Ronnie Landis: Okay, 

Sam Morris: and so it pointed me in this direction of what do I get to do to get to just shift out of this? like Scared little boy. Energy. Is what, cause it’s really what it came down to. Was it like 

Ronnie Landis: self protection? 

Sam Morris: Self protection, and it was all, honestly it was, It was more, um, shame. 

Ronnie Landis: Shame. Like, I 

Sam Morris: just, like every time I saw her I was like, I’m so ashamed of how I showed up, how I’m showing up.

Mm. And that, like, if I’m feeling shame there, Then i’m gonna pull back and then she feels more rejection and more abandonment And so it’s just like this cycle of like it’s literally a death spiral for the rest of the show and so then the We broke up in april and went our separate ways for a couple months and like I got back I got to work.

She got to work and the energy’s cleared. We got back together And there was just a lot of damage there. Really? You know, we, I don’t think we gave each other enough time to really, really recalibrate. Um, and, um, you know, it all came to an end, really, like, September this year. Mm hmm. And, honestly, like, most painful thing I’ve ever experienced.

Mm hmm. You know, it, like, the loss and the grief and, again, it brought me back to that shame. And that I, that from January on was just this, just, I don’t even know what the word for it is, but just this cycle of shame and, and growth and, and all this stuff. And then, you know, it also gave me a lot of perspective of how far I’ve come.

Mm-Hmm. because as much as um, you know, she has this experience, she had this experience of me Mm-Hmm. as that. Yeah. And, um, I would, I. What was happening was, is that I was, I felt so deeply in that shame that I, I wasn’t able to even see myself through her wounded, her wounded version of me. Because I was carrying and like ownership and like taking on this like I Do this and it got to the point where?

Yeah, I just I lost sight of myself Mm hmm So the the real ending here like it really like the past four months or so have been This real call back to like how do I see myself? Like how do I identify myself? Like who what’s my truth? And doing it free of shame and guilt has been real, real magical stuff.

Yeah, wow. Yeah. Wow. 

It’s, it’s 

big. Breakups are Medicine, man, like real potent medicine because I mean, I, and I’ve been on both sides of them and either side is absolutely not easy. Like the human nature wants to be like, Oh, I’m the one that decided to leave. So it’s, and I experienced this with my marriage.

Like I was like for, I got right in another relationship in three years. I’m like, Oh, I’m the one that left the marriage. Like I’m clear, I’m clean. Yeah, really? Yeah. Yeah, I’m not, I still needed to grieve that. And I still needed to like go through the process of, you know, what’s that like of hurting somebody else or did I make 

Ronnie Landis: the right decision?

Sam Morris: Yeah. All the things. And I never gave it the space. And so, and then usually the one that is the one that gets broken up with. Um, there’s so many ways it can go of like, you know, hopping in relationships, or taking time for yourself. And it’s not right or wrong. Like, it is, like, you, in that moment, you’re doing everything that you need to get the medicine that you need for your soul in that moment.

And so, however it looks, post breakup, but that, walking through that process of a separation, like, and the energetic cord cutting, um, you know, long term, I’m saying two years or more. Um, Is a process that is just it gets it gets to be honored and how that looks yeah You know, and if it’s again if it’s going into the relationship, that’s how that’s how that person choose an honor I’ve done that, you know and it’s space and I’ve done that too.

Mm hmm and You know again, not right or wrong, but they it gets to be the breakup gets to be Absorbed. 

Ronnie Landis: Yeah, 

Sam Morris: you know and because it will it’ll point you in the direction. You absolutely need to go 

Ronnie Landis: Yeah, it’s a it’s a medicine experience for sure. 

Sam Morris: I mean, I say like 

Ronnie Landis: I mean the most the most potent 

Sam Morris: I’d say Yes And the other potent one is the actual being in the sacred union.

Oh, 

Ronnie Landis: totally. Yeah. Yes staying in the relationship 

Sam Morris: That that Two years that we were together was lots of medicine for both of us and some really, really amazing times and like glimpses of like amazing potential. And also, yeah, like we can hindsight being like, we both ready of who knows what the fact of medicine is.

We were both there for two years and we were medicine for both of us or whatever we’re experiencing in life. We are each a part of whatever’s happening right now. Right. Separately. You can’t, the magic and the medicine of a sacred union is the most powerful ceremony on the planet. You think you’re ready?

Yeah. 

Ronnie Landis: I mean that was just like going into the ayahuasca ceremony. It’s like, you think you’re ready, but are you really ready for this? It’s like, no, but I’m here too. That’s it. I’m, I’m here and I didn’t know where to go. 

Sam Morris: Yeah. That’s the, that’s the readiness is like, I’m here. You know, ’cause like you’re not, you’re not gonna be ready for what’s coming ’cause you don’t have any fucking clue.

Right. But you can be ready to say like, I’m here for what I don’t know and what I’m gonna be shown and, and standing in the storms and all that. Mm-Hmm. . Mm-Hmm. . And the, and the pleasure too. ’cause the pleasure with the sacred union is also, it’s also next level. Next level. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Not just darkness.

Ronnie Landis: Mm-Hmm. . Mm-Hmm. . Well we covered a lot of territory. Yeah, we did. Um. How, how, how would you like to integrate this conversation? I think we’ve gone, we’ve gone deep into like the medicine path. Talking about bufo, talking about ayahuasca, talking about the medicine journey experience itself. Yeah, the different lessons that come out of it.

Um, and A bit about nervous system regulation, the symptoms of anxiety and dysregulation. Um, talked about relationships, sacred union, heartbreak, healing, um, addiction. Um, recovery. Yeah. Like where, how do we, how do we bring this together? 

Sam Morris: Um, dude, we did cover a lot. 

Ronnie Landis: I mean, this feels like a little bit of a medicine journey in and of itself.

Sam Morris: Yeah, absolutely. That’s it. Like that’s, that’s what it is. How do we honor and integrate our life moment to moment? How do we, like, how do we, um, all the things we just talked about, those are all part of life. Like we, like we talked about five things there. So all of them are like, are the basic pillars of life.

Right. You know? And so I think that to integrate it’s, it’s what integration to me is experience happens. Maybe not all of it’s relevant. Maybe it is. How do we take what’s in that experience? And allow it to shift us allow it to move us allow it to guide us Because if we I mean and nothing gets to be and some things don’t maybe not come with us But I feel like nothing really gets to be discounted.

Yeah Like I think the moment we start looking away from things as like all that doesn’t matter Is the moment that we open ourselves up for cancer disease anxiety all these things Yeah, so the more that we can do To cultivate awareness And I’d say acceptance in life is like really what integration is.

I had a buddy of mine ask me the other day, it’s like about transformational work, like what’s, is self love the base of it all? And I was like, Hmm, that’s a really good question. And I thought about it for a second and I said, Hmm, I don’t think it is. I think that Acceptance is the base of it all because you’re not going to love yourself in every moment.

No, not at all. You’re going to have, like in Ayahuasca, there’s moments where you’re like, wow, I’m a piece of shit. I’ve been there, I’ve experienced it. And if you can accept that part of you, that will lead you to the self love. Because we love, it’s really easy to exile parts of us. 

Ronnie Landis: Easy. The 

Sam Morris: shame part, the guilt part, the addict.

And when we can accept those parts of us, that’s the welcoming back home of those parts of us. And that’s us coming back into wholeness, which is self love. Yeah. So I think that’s, that’s probably the, that’s how I would like to integrate. Yeah. 

Ronnie Landis: I really appreciate that. I agree with that totally. Yeah.

Acceptance is the key and acceptance is the, it’s the doorway that, that leads to self acceptance. And then that leads to more love because then you, you naturally become a more loving person, a more accepting person, a more compassionate person. And then, you know, then you get to give that medicine to yourself.

And so just loving yourself is great, but what does that actually mean? What does that look like? I think it looks like integrity. I think it looks like, um, healthy accountability. Um, and I think integration and integrity are the same thing. Right at the level of the nervous system. If you’re dysregulated or you feel out of integration, you feel disintegrated And scattered and anxious and all that.

I think it’s because the nervous system is processing two separate Selves. Like, so the self that’s addicted and the self that’s not addicted. The self that’s aspiring for better and the self that’s stuck in the victim, I think. And so the nervous system doesn’t know how to reconcile cause there’s a lack of congruency.

So the only way to actually integrate the system is to come into greater integrity, um, between the mind and the body and the self identity and the self concept. So if I’m saying I am about something, But then I’m repeatedly going against that, then there’s going to be this, this, you know, this, this, um, this, uh, stress response, this, this, yeah, dis ease.

Exactly. And then, like you said, like that becomes the open door for. the manifestation of dis ease symptoms, you know, that might take 20 or 30 years to fully manifest. Um, you think it came out of nowhere. Did I eat something? Did I ingest some kind of pollution or I’m doing all the right things of shower filters and cleansing and all this.

And, and that’s key and important. But if you don’t have, I would say like even more of a multi dimensional perspective and awareness, and this is where the medicines come in because they activate, That multidimensional, um, like cosmic, even like cosmic Christ, um, awareness that, that you realize like, Oh, I’m an infinite soul, but I’m in a finite body and both must be honored.

And even the finite body needs to be honored even more so. In a lot of ways, um, because it’s very easy to escape into the infinite kind of cosmological, spiritual aspect, but you know, we are here in these bodies and you don’t want to miss too many moments. And I feel like that’s what these things are.

These crisises or wake up calls are, is they’re like some sort of manifestation to wake us back up to all the un, the, the, um, the moments that we’re missing. It’s like, yo, you’re missing your life. You’re missing all of this. This isn’t going to last forever. You need to wake up and course correct to get back into presence.

And that certainly came up for me a number of times in the journey as well. Just feeling like I’m missing a lot of moments because I’m, you know, I’m still like, you know, whatever, meandering around things that are relevant, but also not that relevant too. 

Sam Morris: Yes. 

Ronnie Landis: Kind of, it’s a paradox. 

Sam Morris: Totally. 

Ronnie Landis: Yeah. Because you’ve got to handle those 

Sam Morris: things.

Yeah. And like, we can get busy always handling those things. And then that’s when you miss the love connections, the eye contact, the, you know, just like a dinner where you’re just laughing with your friends about. Fuck the Simpsons or something like, those moments matter too. And we, like, like, especially in our world, like it gets very serious.

Ronnie Landis: It gets, yeah, I get very serious. 

Sam Morris: And it’s, and it’s, I get it. Like there’s moments when that matters, but it’s also like, really, and this is another medicine recently, mine is joy. Like, like enjoyment is the 3d experience of life, you know? And then, and then we go to the cosmology and the astrals and the spirituality.

All right. To enhance this. Right. Come back here and be more, more present with our lover. More present with our business. More present with our laughter. Like, all these things. But if, yeah, and like you said, it’s both good to be honored. Mm. 

Ronnie Landis: mm-Hmm. . That’s beautiful. Yeah. 

Sam Morris: Yeah. Yeah. Perfect. Great way to end it.

Ronnie Landis: Yeah. Where can everyone find more about you? 

Sam Morris: Uh, Instagram’s the best place. Okay. At Sam Gibbs Morris. Mm-Hmm. Gibbs is G-I-B-B-S. Mm-Hmm. . And then the website is, uh, www.samgibbsmorris.com. 

Ronnie Landis: Mm-Hmm. . Okay. Cool. We’ll have that on the show notes. Awesome, brother. It’s been an honor. Dude, thank you so much. 

Sam Morris: I’m 

so glad 

we got to finally do this.

Yeah, me too. Yeah, man, it’s beautiful. 

Ronnie Landis: Yeah. 

Sam Morris: You’re a beautiful soul, dude. 

Ronnie Landis: Thank you, brother. You too. Thank you. Yeah, appreciate you.