Ronnie Landis: Welcome to the holistic health and human potential podcast.

I am your host, Ronnie Landis. I’m an international speaker, author of multiple books, an integrative nutritionist, a transformation and embodiment coach, and simply a man who has devoted most of my life to the study application and integration And it is my biggest inspiration to bring you weekly episodes that will expand your mind, challenge your paradigm, deepen your heart, and help you to embody the greatest version of yourself.

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Greetings everyone. Welcome to another edition of the holistic human optimization show. Landis. And today we are joined. By Dr. Gabriel Cousins. This will be the third time that Dr. Cousins has appeared on this show. And it’s just a really great honor for me. Dr. Cousins has been someone that I’ve considered to be from a distance and just.

really one of the first people that I got his work I got into and it just made a profound effect on me about 10 years ago when I got into living foods and it invoked It invoked the spirit of living foods, not necessarily just the diet. That’s what I was getting into. I think that’s how we all get started, but it invoked the spirit of the lifestyle and it penetrated something very deep in me and started my unfolding.

It started my, my awakening through nutrition, not just getting into a diet, not just getting into. you know, a fad or anything like that, just to work on, you know, my, my physical body or my athletic performance, but it really touched something deep in my core. And I have a great, um, debt of, uh, just gratitude and honor and appreciation for every time I get to exchange words with this man.

And he’s a true legend, a true pioneer in the field of living foods, but really the field of holistic health and healing as a whole. And, uh, you know, like I said, it’s a great honor. So thank you so much for joining me, Dr. Cousins. 

Dr. Gabriel Cousens: Well, I really appreciate working with you. You ask really good questions and you have a really good understanding of the bigger picture.

Ronnie Landis: I think that is a perfect thing to start with because the bigger picture for me in my life. It’s always been, you know, since I was raised as a martial artist from the age of four years old, and I was introduced into Taoist philosophy and Eastern mysticism and spirituality growing up in a Western world on a, on a, whatever you want to call it, a, a nutritional Holocaust, basically.

And you know, it’s amazing that I even survived, let alone performed as a professional athlete when I look back on it, but the bigger picture that you just brought up really. Really, um, just bring something up for me because In my life, I can, you know, I think all of us in life can get so myopic and focused on the details and the, the, the temporal aspects of life, but the big picture of like, why are we here?

What is the point of all of this? And, and ultimately for me is like, what’s my point? What’s my purpose? And how can I, how can I create a lifestyle that supports So I’d like to just ask you as we start, what is the big picture exactly? 

Dr. Gabriel Cousens: Well, for everyone, it’s a little different, but for me, from a spiritual point of view, the purpose we are here on the planet, the purpose we incarnate time and time again, Is for the evolution of the soul, ultimately moving back into unity with the One.

It’s really for liberation. We can’t eat our way to God. But, what we can do is eat in a way that we become superconductors of the Divine. And so, it makes us most ready. to hold the energy, to have a vessel that can hold the energy. Now, back in the 70s, um, in India, after a deep meditation, a little voice rang out and said, you need to eat and live in a way that supports the Kundalini.

And Kundalini is the, the evolutionary spiritual force. that everybody has within themselves. So the question is how do you eat in a way that supports it? Now in the yogic system, we have 72, 000 nadis, which are the channels that move the kundalini energy. The three main ones, ida, pangala, and shishumna. And the shishumna, which has three, is really four nadis, but basically is the flow where the energy goes in the merging with the one.

And what became very clear. As I worked with thousands of people, is that meat, fish, chicken, and dairy clog the nadis. Uh, they impede the flow of kundalini. They also bring the energy of death into our system, and that’s not just our chakras and nadi, but also what we call the koshas, which are the layers of the mind.

So, it blocks it in, you know, literally a physical level, clogging the nadis, but also on the spiritual level of the energy of death. It’s really only one. Tradition that, uh, really kind of supports eating meat. But when you look at the Torah tradition, you look at the Daoist tradition, the Daoist masters, they were live fooders, okay?

And, and you look at really the, the Vedic, uh, uh, practitioners 2, 000 years ago, they’re all live fooders. So we have that kind of bigger picture. Garden of Eden. What do you got? You know, the fruits and vegetables and grasses, the field and the fruit of a seed bearing tree. It’s a lively vegan diet. So when you kind of see the bigger picture, that’s the diet we’re giving for optimizing human evolution.

And so I kind of moved in that direction. Uh, for my own inner experience, as well as observing and working with many people with the Kundalini Awakening. So, that became my diet. So I became 90, you know, 100 percent vegan, 1973, and 100 percent live, 99 percent live food vegan, 1983. Pretty much that’s the way it’s been.

And that’s what, that best helps one become a superconductor of the divine. That’s not our purpose. We can’t eat our way to God. Again, I make that point because people think we can’t. It just makes us a better vehicle so the energy, we can hold more energy and go deeper into the purpose of humanity from a spiritual point of view, which is a merge back with God.

And that’s pretty much how I organize everything I do. 

Ronnie Landis: That, that actually completely answers the first question I had for you. And, you know, what I, what I thought about when you mentioned that, I remember maybe about seven years ago as I was getting deep into the, you know, the scene gospel of peace and really your work kind of, um, because of the nuggets that you would leave behind, I got tuned into, Oh, wow, this is a whole different deal than like getting onto a die.

It’s. Everything that I had been accustomed to before and one of the books that came across my radar was breaking the death habit by Leonard or and that was one of those books that was like a paradigm shifter because it really in this one of the things that you talk about a lot is is Not investing in the culture of death.

And that really continues to be on the forefront of my consciousness. Like this is really deep. And in that book by Leonard Orr, he really talks about breaking this deep death habit, this self sabotage that we, that somehow has been conditioned into us. And I, I, you know, I’ve talked to Michael Beckwith, I’ve talked to many different people about this.

Um, to understand, like, what is that, that thing inside of us that almost, like, wants to sabotage our own growth and evolution and, and can make it very challenging to truly awaken to who we really are. 

Dr. Gabriel Cousens: So, one way I think about it, because it’s a real human problem, I’m going to use the word desire and resist for God.

Okay. And once you get that, we understand that we humans are, are a mix. And first I, I do kind of more mental, spiritual kind of process to help people let go of their desire to resist, you know, in, in, in the internal thought form level, and then you have to play it up, what I mean by playing it out is the more we’re confronted with the resistance, the more we write it.

Make the right choices to expand consciousness. It gets easier and easier. Focus on the desire part. Once the Kundalini is awakened, uh, as I described spiritually, you know, nutrition is like a bull in heat. I was just driven. Even what we call Tehsikat Devi Kuth, uh, the Divine Desire, Mamuk Shukfa, the Desire for the Divine.

So that gets activated, and the more we make the choices that support that, the more it gets activated. So it’s important to understand there really is a desire and resistance to the human condition. And more important to know, the more we face that resistance, And not blame it on anybody else and move through it the easier and easier it gets They keep making the decisions that bring us closer to the light So first we have to acknowledge that it exists get out of the fairy land Second we have to be clear that it is happening and we we have choices.

We have free will on this level Well, as it gives us the choice to grow spiritually, if we make choices that elevate ourselves spiritually. So it’s a really great opportunity. Now, uh, part of that story is that we have the, uh, sex urge and death urge, which is what we’re talking about. But beneath that we have what I call the non causal peace and non causal love.

and non causal joy, and non causal oneness, and non causal compassion. We tap into that, which is our deepest primordial human instinct, deeper than the death urge, okay, which is what we’re talking about. We tap into that through meditation, which is It begin to be released and it begins to drive us to higher levels of consciousness.

k the , the desire for God. And that’s again, when that gets set off, like with the kini awakening, it gets more and more amplified, makes it easier to make the choices that ex so that, that expand the spiritually. So that’s kind of the, the story. So it’s actually a really good thing. That desire to resist because it actually helps us grow spiritually.

And that’s, in a sense, a little bit the role of evil. Evil, not that evil would like to think about it that way. But evil is the resistance part. When it pops up, the more we choose not to go with it, the stronger we get spiritually. So it’s there to elevate us if we choose to make it be that way. 

Ronnie Landis: Yeah, that absolutely beautifully well put and that brings up that that can be its own show in of itself.

And I’m tempted to go deeper into the rabbit hole of that. But, um, I do have some other questions that I’d like to I’d like to drive for. Um, the first one is, I’d really like to ask you about brain health and natural strategies for cognitive enhancement, because there’s this growing movement of um, Focus on brain supplementation and enhancing mental cognition, um, through, through things called nootropics and some being natural, some being very unnatural.

And I’ve been, I’ve been kind of navigating that realm throughout the years and experimenting and just seeing like, okay, what, what seems to be helpful short term, but without the longterm, uh, you know, biological bankruptcy that can happen when we, we, do unnatural supplements or, or, or brain enhancing, um, substances that, that can actually have a detrimental effect longterm have been just really always, I’m always interested in activating genius and obviously genius isn’t just a byproduct of the brain.

It’s, it’s a full awakening as you mentioned, but I just want to go kind of, I want to go a little myopic for, for a moment in that particular direction. So what are strategies? That you’ve employed in your own practice and seen be extremely successful for long term neurological health and increasing cognitive performance.

Dr. Gabriel Cousens: Okay, so part of how I look at it is that the whole thing is to eat and live in a way that’s going to enhance our natural neurotransmitter production. Okay. Okay, let’s kind of start with that. What I’ve observed over time, without any supplements, is that on a live food diet, the brain begins to move towards optimal neurotransmitter secretion.

I’m going to say the brain and the gut, because the gut neurotransmitter. It may be more than the brain, but the principle is that, and what I found is on a live food diet, we optimize the balanced secretion and production of neurotransmitters that optimizes brain function. And, um, that’s a really key concept.

Is that really just the live food diet alone is, uh, is sufficient to really optimize our neurotransmitter production and balance it. You know, that being said, a lot of people are out of balance and not been out of balance for a long time. So we have to, okay, fine. Now, how do we get to that place? Now, there is an interesting study, uh, with people that survived Stalingrad, the Russians fighting Hitler.

And what they found is that these people were under chronic, chronic stress, and the result is that their production of dopamine, the feel good, Okay, neurotransmitters decreased because they were under chronic stress for such a long time that it got more, more permanently stuck there. It wouldn’t get out of it, but it got more permanently stuck.

And they, they had a very high percentage of alcoholism. Well, just to know, alcohol can, it gives a false stimulation. of a kind of a similar, an analog neurotransmitter, but it actually blocks neurotransmitter production, but they high percentage of alcoholism because they got something of wellbeing. Okay.

So that’s kind of an important model because it tells us if we are focusing not on God and not on optimizing your neurotransmitter, we began to, More permanently switch off our dopamine production, you see, and so part of the work is how to do it now. More recently, as I’ve done research, when we see brain scans, it turns out pornography actually changes the shape of your brain.

And actually, upsets the flow of blood to the key areas of the brain and the prefrontal cortex. And so there’s actually a brain degeneration. It’s the same principle. Okay. So when we kind of look at it, it’s like, okay, now we really have to upgrade the brain, bring it back to normal function. If we see our tasks that way, that’s kind of where I, I begin with that.

Uh, particularly these, these pictures of people. bit about pornography. They really do have brain degeneration in certain particular areas. So that’s the role of what I’m going to say neurotransmitter precursors that encourage the system to begin producing their neurotransmitters again. For example, for dopamine mucopurines.

It’s an herb. And it tends to stimulate dopamine production. Well, what I’ve observed is, you know, three months, six months on this, gets the flow going so the brain remembers, Oh, well, yeah, I can do this. And then you phase people off it. So, it’s kind of, uh, a calculated, thing. It’s like, let’s get this stimulated.

For women, there’s more, particularly in menopause, there’s a big drop in serotonin. Okay. And so we can do certain things that support that, like the tryptophan will build it up or, you know, 5 HTP. But the point I’m making, it’s the same principle. The principle is how do we stimulate brain function? How do we get enough vitamin B and natural vitamin to vitamin B to stimulate it?

And uh, there’s a variety of neurotransmitter stimulators. That help that and I won’t go through the kind of a whole list of that. That’s really not the point. The point is as we use these precursors that okay, stimulate acetylcholine, which is good for memory, you know, which goes down and we use the long chain omega threes, which we get from yellow algae, not from fish.

There’s a reason for that too, because fish fat destroys the beta cells of the pancreas. Not so cool. Most people don’t know that. So, you know, so what we’re saying is we start to use these things, uh, to build up the normal function. Now, once the normal function is happening, then it’s a lot easier to, uh, for the brain and got to take over again.

So we have to see that like there’s two steps here. when you’ve really, really, really been deficient. And that, of course, is happening on the junk food diet that people are living on. So, we try to create a transition time, that’s how I see it, to get the flow going. And then, what actually literally happens, is we begin to develop not just more neurotransmitters, but post synaptic.

Uh, sites where it can link into. Otherwise, because you can produce more, but if you don’t have where they can link into, they can’t function. So the brain literally begins to build dopamine receptor sites and serotonin receptor sites. As it’s just because when the brain is, thank goodness, it’s plastic.

You know, it can change its shape. So it’s really quite significant of what we can do to do that. And then all along the baseline has to be the life of the vegan diet. That’s the baseline. Uh, because without that, you’re, you’re just shooting supplements in it. It doesn’t take us into repair. We’ve got to have the repair part and you need your baseline support system to make that repair happen.

And so that’s how I began to see it in, in. And my observation very consistently is indeed that the Life With Vegan diet is the best diet for supporting enhanced neurotransmitter production and more important also in a balanced way. Gotta have two pieces there. 

Ronnie Landis: Yeah, this is this is bringing up some distinctions for me.

Um, one of the things I’ll just I’ll just point out that you said and you’ve said it many times before there’s a difference between a healing diet or a short term or maybe in this case a repair approach. 

Dr. Gabriel Cousens: Yeah, we’re talking repair here actually. Yeah, 

Ronnie Landis: I just want to make that distinction and the other thing I want to get a a little more definition on.

is a live food vegan approach because I have seen, I’ve seen that some people on certain types of living food diets, like high sugar hybridized domesticated fruits and unripened fruits, um, and mineral deficient foods that go a little too, too Off the deep end in some cases, I’ve seen a lot of, um, what I would call neurological or even psychological disturbances over time of doing those approaches.

And I think there’s a, there’s, um, there’s a really necessary distinction or definition that I’d like to get from you when you say live food diet, can we unpack that just a little bit? So people listening 

Dr. Gabriel Cousens: first principle, which you’ve already alluded to is it has to be individualized. Now this isn’t theoretical, this isn’t just a philosophical discussion.

On chromosome 19, literally, it has gene code sites for how much protein you need, how much fat you need, and how much carbohydrate you need. That’s hugely important. So I try to help people tune in to actually their genetic diet. Okay. As I say, it is genetically encoded. Okay. So about 30 percent of the people need a lower protein diet, high, high complex carbohydrate, and 70 percent need a higher protein diet.

You know, I’m talking plant protein, whatever I’m talking about. And. There’s a thing called the mTOR pathway, which basically shows for longevity and anti cancer. It’s somewhere between 35 and 70 grams a day of protein, which is not a whole lot. Okay. When you really get what people are taking in with the different diets, it’s not a lot.

Even 70 grams isn’t really a lot. So it’s critical that we understand that we are unique human beings. We’re not a bunch of cows that just eat grass. Okay. Okay. It’s a really important idea. You know, as obvious as it is, people are still arguing. There’s one diet for everybody and there, there just isn’t.

Okay. I mean, yes, there’s a live food diet. That’s a general, yes, it’s vegan. That’s a general, but I’m not talking about that. I’m talking to the mix of carbohydrates, fats, and protein. The other thing I’m talking about is with age, it varies. So for example, men don’t have a. Uh, kind of too much protein in their forties, uh, twice the amount of mortality for the times, the amount of cancer, but above 65, your protein need increases.

Uh, my own personal example is I’m a person, it really doesn’t have much protein eight to 10%, and mostly you’re doing vegetables and sprouts, but nuts and seeds a little bit. And I, uh, was at about 25 pull ups. Okay, and kind of stuck. I wasn’t progressing and I looked at this and said, well, it says people a little bit older.

I was 65 at the time. It’s like a little bit more protein. I added one tablespoon. A blue green allergy in two weeks come up to 50 pull ups, and I’ve hit 100, okay? Maybe averaging 80, 90, you know. One go? Yeah, one go. Wow, 

Ronnie Landis: that’s impressive. 

Dr. Gabriel Cousens: But, but, you get my point. I mean, one tablespoon shift, and suddenly, everything began to move.

That’s my point here. So, we have to also judge it according to your age, according to your genetics, really according to an oribetic, your dosha, or your high protein, low protein. So there, there are a bunch of discussion involved in this. Now, I think that’s the important thing. There’s another thing that’s important, and it goes along with more protein with age, is the research shows that, uh, people with a high complex carbohydrate diet above the age of 70 have four times greater cognitive decline, and people who have More fat in their diet.

I’m going to talk plant fat, have 42%, uh, you know, decrease in the cognitive decline. It’s very dead. It’s a huge difference. So I’m trying to move away from philosophy with this. Well, this fruitarian is the greatest thing, or this diet is the greatest thing. It doesn’t matter. You gotta follow your genetics.

So my coaching on the live food diet begins to get clear is how to help people follow their genetics. So first thing is, do you need less protein or more protein? And that’s a question I have a whole questionnaire. It’s simple, 30 questions. to gain that weight. And, and then we look at the carbohydrate and we look at the fat.

Basically, I’m going to say a range, I’m not talking about diabetics now, but just a range is, is about 25 to 45 percent carbohydrate. And I’m talking about leafy greens, I’m not talking bananas here, okay? I’m talking leafy greens, and sprouts, and sea vegetables. So, kind of full range of that. Um, a little bit, not so much with the carrots and beets, because they’re very high in sugar.

Okay, we know that sugar accelerates Alzheimer’s disease. You know, with diabetics, you get twice as much Alzheimer’s. That’s a consideration. So that’s the carbohydrate, the fat 25 to 45%. So I know initially in the last food diet, you know, in the eighties, people were freaked out about, can’t have fat in your diet and you need a 10%.

And that turns out to be very detrimental. People with, uh, with a low fat diet are more likely to have. Or suicides, homicides, and you know, I’m talking serious things. Uh, I’ll take the word cholesterol, which is a big fear word, okay? And what they found is that people who are the are very low in cholesterol, has six times more homicide and suicide.

Okay, that’s serious. If you’re just in the lower 20, uh, 25%, just at that point, you’re doubling your rate of suicide. So we’re talking serious disorganization. And also with that, you’re, you’re talking a lot more stroke, more, uh, Emotional imbalance and again, as I say, more depression, not just suicide, but depression.

So we really have to have the right amount of cholesterol. My research shows somewhere between 160, you know, around 160 is the low level. Somebody comes in at 140, I’m concerned because I know that makes them more susceptible for depression and suicide. What do I do to raise it up? A little bit of coconut oil looks fine.

It’s not hard. The research now shows between a cluster between one 60 and two 60. In other words, no, we’re not going to worry about it at two 60. I don’t know too many vegans at two 60. We don’t see it because mostly 80 percent of the cholesterol we make ourselves, but basically the AMA research published.

It’s basically, uh, 2009 of 30 years of studies. Basically, if you’re between 160 and 260, don’t worry about heart disease, no problem, okay? Now, women who are a cluster of 270 actually live 28 percent longer than women of 193 or less. So I kind of want to dispel the cholesterol thing. And we don’t really have to worry about it.

The real danger is the fear of cholesterol that drives us to a low fat diet. That’s the big deal. The other thing is when you go on a low fat diet, well, what are you going to do? Well, there’s carbohydrates and protein. You can only do so much protein. So suddenly you’re upping your carbohydrates. So in my book, um, there is a cure for diabetes.

I track my results and Esselstyn’s results and so forth. Um, Basically, people, the triglycerides, high triglycerides can really amplify heart attacks, heart disease. So in my study, with my people, started on a very high blood sugar of 247, very high, versus like 165, basically. Uh, we found that the triglycerides dropped to 82, which is really, really good.

Significantly lower than two studies with a 10%. Uh, fat diet, mine’s 25 to 45%. You see what I’m saying? So we have to do according to our constitution, we have to use a little bit of common sense and there isn’t one day for everybody. So what I’ve observed is the low fat, 10 percent low fat in particular.

I’m emphasizing this. People really get off on that. And, uh, 25, 45 percent complex carbohydrates and protein somewhere between 10 and I’m going to say 15 to 20%. Now a person just needs about 10 percent protein. I was probably at 8 percent and then I added that one little tablespoon and then boom. And I needed that.

So as I say, I’m up to 90. You know, I’ve hit a hundred, but around 90 pull ups at one time, you know, and my 601 pushups and all that kind of thing, those are all at one time, but the strength increases when you get the optimum diet. So the key when we talk about food, it really needs to be your genetically optimum diet.

And it does require some trial and error. In my books, I have some interviews so you can begin to figure out which way to go. Um, and, uh, that’s key. You know, uh, Spirit to Nutrition and Kundalini, uh, Rainbow Green Life Food Cuisine, there are interviews, Conscious Eating, there are interviews. People can do it.

It’s not hard. But it’s only hard if you think there’s one diet for everybody. You’re in trouble. Okay. Then you’re talking about your ego. Cause it works for me. Therefore it must work for you. No, that’s not the way it works. It works for me because it works for me, but you have a different genetics. You know, we have 20, 30, 000 genes, 200, 000 gene variations.

Come on, we’re different. We’re unique. That’s good. That’s a positive. Let’s go after our uniqueness. So it takes some Intelligence and some trial and error. So does that kind of give you a feeling for it? But the overall diet that you know, the average 25 45 percent plant based fat 25 to 45 percent complex carbohydrates And, and I don’t really use grains.

I’m gonna make a little point, though. Uh, we know the Daoist masters, uh, basically said bi gu, you know what that means? No grains. No grains. And they had that figured out from 475 B. C. Okay. It’s not new information. So basically, uh, in about 10, as I say, to 15 to 20 percent protein, we’re in that range. Uh, the biggest mistake people in the live food diet, vegan diet have made is this anti cholesterol thing.

Oh, see, we’re going to protect you against heart disease. Well, it doesn’t really, and it really doesn’t protect you from neurological degeneration, which is where this start question started. You need a certain amount of cholesterol and the result really shows up that people with a higher cholesterol, and I mean higher, over 160, definitely have better cognitive function.

That’s very important. So I’m kind of, I’m winding around. So we need a certain amount of fat, but we are actually, we make our own cholesterol. We need a good functioning liver, which makes it, but the point I’m making is don’t worry about cholesterol. Okay. And actually higher cholesterol 160 or a little bit above is going to support cognitive function.

And memory. So we’ve got like a whole circle, and we vary in between. There’s no one way to do it. If we get that, then we really begin to understand.

Ronnie Landis: Yeah, that really impacts a lot and provides a lot of distinctions for people, and I think that’s just so valuable. I know on my journey, I’ve been gone, I’ve gone through all the hoopla, I’ve gone through all the ideologies, like I’ve gone back to, uh, Herbert Sheldon and, and Johnny Love Wisdom and all the back, uh, Victoria Skulls Venskis and all the way back to First of all, I just wanted to understand if I was going to commit myself to this movement and actually be some kind of representative of it for my generation, I better know where this thing came from.

I better actually know how this came to being. And, um, then I, I went through a state of confusion because I started having, I started seeing All the variations and all the different, but intrinsically in me, something kind of knew that a lot of it, at least for me, what like the high, super, super high fruit thing wasn’t going to work for me.

Cause as an athlete, when I was making a big transition from, um, going from cooked food and going from animal food and going into vegetarianism and then eventually going 100 percent raw vegan. Um, I think it’s about maybe eight or nine years ago, I noticed that I went really high onto the fruits and just pretty much just fruit and vegetables.

And my body actually went through a deep cleansing process. And I noticed I started to get really skinny and really gaunty, but my mom, but I have this, Ideology in my head and people were telling me like, Hey, you know, like kind of, it looks like you’re kind of wasting away. I don’t know if this is really working.

And at my energy levels were going down and eventually I was like, geez, like I need to go eat some eggs or something. Cause I feel horrible. And then I did. And it kind of like, it kind of, I got, I got something. I was like, Oh, okay. There’s something there. But then, you know, but then my heart was calling me back to back to reevaluate.

I was like, I want to do plant based. So I went through that experiment for a long time until I could really get educated and get a, get an understanding of like, Oh, I actually need. That and there’s this whole malarkey of people out there. Um that are like, you know Basically holding this banner against fad and I felt kind of attacked a lot of times when I started to actually share Information and so after going through all that and coming to my own sovereignty my own My own confidence in myself and and not worrying about what the banter the bandwidth the band The flag waving people on the other end.

I just realized like I feel good on this approach. I feel good following Um following a higher fat approach and that became my guidance and I guess what i’m kind of trying to trying to allude for people watching is that You know, it’s your own choose your adventure story. It’s an you know, you’ve got to be able to experiment with yourself You’ve got to take the information, but you got to check in with yourself And I think that’s really the the spiritual side of it, right?

Like we have to trust ourself and not trust the authorities or the newborn experts out there on youtube That are taking something if they feel good for a month and all of a sudden it’s like, you know, it’s the holy gospel and it’s unshakable, 

Dr. Gabriel Cousens: right? Um, that’s why I speak up. You know, I, I’ve been doing this for a while, you know, eight, 1983 till now.

That’s like 35, 40 years. Okay. And consistently getting stronger. I actually tried a fruitarian diet for two years. And I did okay, because I’m a person who doesn’t need a lot of protein. But I wasn’t as strong as I knew I could be. So then, I went back and created the Rainbow Green Life Food Cuisine. And a year later, I’m doing 600 push ups.

Okay? So, I did okay with it, because I didn’t have that need for a higher protein. But 70 percent of the population needs a higher protein back. So, we really hurt people. Thank you. I’m a little sensitive, but like, I don’t want to hurt anybody here. I’m not going to give you a theory, let’s show you how to figure out how to individualize your diet so you can be optimally successful.

And really, I would say 99 percent of the people I work with, 99 percent plus who kind of follow this way of thinking are successful. It really does concern me and people more in the vegan movement, they’re high in this high complex carbohydrate diet, low fat, low protein, and they’re eating fish once a week.

And, uh, and you know, and they admit it and it’s like, wait. Why, what, what’s going on here, you know, it’s because they’re believing in a religious theory rather than a scientific approach, you know, and I think that’s the key, key concept. So I advise people, look, it’s in your genes. You got a trial and error.

I get, you know, in my books, as I say, Conscious Eating, My Great Life as a Cuisine, uh, Spiritual Nutrition, Kundalini. There are questions. But you can ask yourself, and you can get put in the right direction, and then you have to actually think for yourself. Trial and error, which is what you were doing. You weren’t doing the belief system line.

You were really saying, no, I want to be authentic, and I want to know what’s going to work for me. Because I’m a unique being. Not a cop. So there we go. So I honor you for that, because you have to kind of trust yourself. And in your integrity, um, in that, of course, goes right into spirituality because there’s not only one way of being with God and there’s not only one this way or one that, you know, so again, how, how is it that we kind of have that unique relationship with the divine?

Well, we’re all a little different. I tend to meditate a lot. Okay. Um, that really works for me. And I joke, I say everything I’ve ever learned was from meditating, playing football. Okay. Because they’re different qualities. But my point is, and that directs me. Okay. Uh, more meditating now than playing football.

But my point is, is, is that we are unique and we need to go in and see what optimizes us for spiritual life. Mental, emotional, and physical, because all have to be in mental. So what I saw a lot of people doing this low fat, low protein diet in the early 80s, when they came back from India, I was like, Wow, people really are not very grounded here.

They’ve done cleansing, cleansing, cleansing. But they’ve, they’ve lost track of who they are, and they’re a lot of spaced out people. And I helped a lot of people by adding more fat and protein back into the diet, according to the Constitution. You know, my point is, I don’t care if you’re, you know, how much protein or this.

What I care is, You should have optimal function, physically, emotionally, mentally, and spiritually. That’s what matters. And that’s how you can judge how you’re doing. And it has to be over time. You know, a minimum of three months, but really a year or two. You know, can you consistently hold the energy?

That’s how I look at it. So when I look at, you know, my 35 years on my food, I have a pretty good idea. And at age 75, I’m getting stronger and more flexible, you know? So obviously it works. So I have another level of testimony. Yeah. If you pay attention, it does work. Got to pay attention. That’s the key.

Ronnie Landis: Yeah, you got to pay attention. And sometimes I don’t want to go into the whole thing of that. Cause I have two more questions I want to make sure we can make space for, but that’s such an important point. Paying attention to the details is so essential. And yet there is because in the social media world, this instant gratification, um, whatever we want to call it to describe this kind of, um, this, uh, this habit.

Of deferring from paying attention to the details but pretending like we know what’s going on But we’re almost like avoiding the truth right avoiding looking at the actual truth that’s showing up in our life And, and pretending that something is working when it’s like to any, any logical person looking at the situation, it’s like, uh, you know what, I don’t think that whatever, whatever the thing is that you think is working so well is actually working out the way you think it’s like self deception, right?

Dr. Gabriel Cousens: Yes. So it’s a, it’s an interesting question, uh, in, in, in a certain way. What I mean by that. It is that particularly today, it’s like, cause I feel it. It’s so okay. And we want to check in partly with our friends, you know, what’s our social feed, serious feedback, people you trust, how am I feeling? Okay. How am I thinking?

What is my strength level? I mean, we have to ask real questions. And we can measure it. That’s why I make a big thing about the push ups and pull ups. I can measure it. I know how I’m doing by how I’m doing. I’m not making it up. I’m not guessing. If I can do 100 pull ups on my diet, hey, great. And all I did is a tablespoon of, you know, blueberry milk.

You see what I’m saying? So we want to take that, that, the theoretical and the guesswork. It’s super important to trust yourself and have people around you that are going to give you honest feedback. Now, there’s another quality that you’ve raised. There’s a study from 1910 to 1990. That’s an 80 year study that looked at qualities that make longevity.

Uh, diet was like maybe five in it, five or six, which would shock me. Fastidiousness, okay. Ranked really in the top five, that means paying attention to the details of your life. That was really interesting. So you’re fastidious. I’m fastidious. Okay. These are the top five. there too. Um, but this is a bigger way of looking at, okay.

Uh, love is a very, is up there and, uh, collectiveness like social relations. These are high, high markers. in longevity. People live along us. So those are the, the big, you know, some of the big pictures in that. Um, so social relationships, love in your life, and this may sound funny, but we also found that the research, okay, Which is with a lot of people, but there are people show that people had a lot of initiative and creative that seem to be it.

And that relates to purpose for living. Okay. Purpose for living. So those are like in that cluster of the, of the top qualities. Uh, so even the diet doesn’t, it’s not at the top, but it’s in the top six, you know. 

Ronnie Landis: Well, I really appreciate you bringing it up is one of the things I had a conversation with Dr.

Brian Clement a little while ago for this show, and we really got deep into This whole thing is he brought up the same point. He was like, people are making the diet or the fitness routine, the main thing, but really the main thing is your dream. And do you have a dream? And if not, we need to focus on what is your dream?

Because that, in my personal opinion, I’m finding myself out talking more about that to people than just about the details of the diet. And I find that if somebody has a dream, something that compels them, an impulse from their heart and their soul, that’s. Almost pulling them toward you. That, that to me, I mean, we can, we can just look at the world at large.

There is most people, you know, entrepreneurs or people that we think are like really successful or really happy. Most of them are not living on a living food diet. Most of them are not perfect with their diet, but what they do have is a dream and they have something to live for. And I feel like. When you have something to live for, it causes you to actually want to live more, and maybe that’s the deadline.

You don’t want to check out. You actually want to get more out of this thing. 

Dr. Gabriel Cousens: So I’m going to use a different term. It’s a Native American term called sacred design. In other words, People can have lots of dreams and sometimes those dreams may not be very right on. Okay. So because that We live in a world of illusion, too But but sacred design is like a little bit deeper It says what is my real purpose in life besides there’s two purposes.

Okay, you have your to know god Virgin god, but also people have their gifts to give that’s what I mean a little bit by sacred design You Is what is your gift and the beginning giving of that now, uh, I was on a Spanish speaking kind of tour and we were hiking throughout Mexico with the Spanish teacher and we ended up after a rainstorm in a pay at a Native American village and they, they were peyote people.

I mean, I was out of the rain. I was pretty heavy. But, um, their tradition, which I loved, is that when a child be born, the shamans would get together and vision, trying to tune into that child sacred design. Are you gonna be a farmer? Are you gonna be a shaman? Are you, what are you gonna do? And they would tune into it.

In India, they do the same thing with astrology and things like that. So there’s a real effort to say you have a purpose in life. You have a contribution to give, whether you’re a farmer, whether you’re this, and tuning in to sacred design. That’s kind of missing in our society. That’s why I’m pointing out these, you know, this, um, Indian village kind of up in the mountains somewhere in Mexico.

I don’t know. We were really lost. It was a huge flood, but wherever we were, okay, but that’s what they did. And that, you know, uh, in very indigenous levels, like child’s work, what’s that child’s sacred design. So when people are onto their sacred design, they have purpose and meaning and value in their life.

And that’s a driving force and that’s in the top five. So I found that it was really kind of interesting and looking at it. And then, you know, it’s. So I know when Brian’s saying it, he’s really talking about that, when he says the dream. He’s not talking about your illusion. He’s talking about your dream in a good way.

I do understand that. Yeah. But I use sacred design because it’s sacred. Yeah. When you have a design, we all have our roles. And it’s like, okay, what’s my role here? Okay, that’s my point. And, um, in India we call it Dharma. Okay, which is Dharma, which is right livelihood. So, different traditions, but they say the same thing.

Ronnie Landis: That’s, that’s beautiful. Um, with the time we have left, I want to, I want to ask you questions. A little bit of a different energy, but I have a feeling it’s going to actually pull everything full circle in an interesting way. And, um, The more i’ve gotten deeper into this approach and I have to really credit David Wolf for really compelling me to go deeper into the subject of vaccinations the subject the more the the more fear based subjects the more controversial subjects and really Help open Myself first and foremost to the reality of what is going on in our world.

And so The knowledge that there is an underlining agenda of control and deception That has really penetrated all areas of agriculture our food supply our banking systems political systems and religious institutions Is something that I found for me to be essential to understand almost A quest to understand the nature of evil in a in a way from a psychological perspective and then um, so I wanted to just get your take on what this Agenda is really about and how can the average individual take their power back?

Dr. Gabriel Cousens: It’s a great question I really respect david wolf. He’s really very smart and he does understand these things and um So talking to that question Everything we’re talking about is about that question because there’s an interface between the individual and the society Okay, and there’s a kind of limit to how far you want to go, but the point is the people at levels where they call them Illuminati, from them the globalists, and the people above Illuminati, it goes on and on, okay?

Their goal is more to enslave humanity. And I’m sure you’ve heard David say that, right? 

Ronnie Landis: And the others as well. 

Dr. Gabriel Cousens: What? And others, right. So that’s your goal. Okay. Let’s be out front about it. Okay. How do you get enslaved? When you don’t have a functioning mind, when you can’t think clearly, uh, okay. When you can’t provide for yourself, you become dependent.

Okay. But there is a, um, I’m going to call it the cracking of the American mind. It’s a worldwide problem. You know, obviously you see it going on Europe. People have kind of lost their minds in some level. They don’t have proper nutrition. The neurotransmitters aren’t working. Spiritually, they’re not connected to the divine.

There’s a lot of satanic stuff going on. Hollywood is very out front about it, okay? All the way to cannibalism. That’s public. Didn’t used to be public. So I’m not saying anything that’s new information. So we have the forces of light and darkness or satanic forces struggling their goal to enslave humanity.

And there’s a thousand different ways that’s going on. So we don’t want to Get into that. Exactly. And when we eat this way, uh, uh, live food, being in diet, when we do things that upgrade the functioning of our mind, we’re linked to people who can kind of support us and keep us grounded. Then, uh, we’re able to sustain our, our uniqueness and sustain, let’s say, our, not only thinking, but spiritual purpose in life.

So when you’re enslaved, you lose your spiritual purpose, you lose your name in a sense. So the first thing Moses did, or what they did, coming out of Egypt is they named everybody. That’s why the second book is called Shemot. Names, not accidents, slaves don’t have names. You’re in a Nazi camp. You’ve got a number.

You don’t exist as a person. So when we support our unique individuality and that of everybody else within the larger harmony of society, We are able to create an independence that keeps us from being diluted, buying the propaganda of, you know, the national, international media and all that type of thing that wants us to buy the propaganda.

Uh, and so we keep ourselves from being enslaved, but you need a functioning mind, okay? Uh, and I, I think that’s the key, and you know, I haven’t talked to David in a while, but I’m sure he would agree with that. That we want a functioning mind, then we can start distinguishing between the forces of light and darkness, and not become enslaved.

So that’s the way it works. In the live food vegan diet, It is the optimum diet when it’s properly applied. So your mind is working right and you are grounded, you know, and you have strength of character and strength of purpose and strength of mind, then it’s very hard to enslave. And that’s the way I would kind of look at it.

Um, I’ll take it one step further, but we’re not going to be able to answer it, because we’re out of time, probably. But, we call the Mark of the Beast, is when, in a sense, we have given up our unique, individually, in relationship with God. And when we put the seal of God on our forehead, which is everything we’re talking about, there’s no room for the Mark of the Beast.

Just think about that. Um, because it’s, it’s, it’s another hour of discussion and a variety of techniques that can help clear us from some of this. So um, and I have been sharing some of that on Facebook a little bit, certain very specific meditations. But again, that will take us into another detailed level.

So that’s how I look at it. The live food vegan diet is the one that best keeps us from being enslaved, that best amplifies our functioning of our mind and our body so that we can. Know our uniqueness and stand up against the mass propaganda, the mass collective Degeneration. So we’re not involved with the cracking of the American mind.

Ronnie Landis: I really love what Charles Dickens wrote in his book Tale of Two Cities in the intro Which is it was the worst of times and best of times all at the same time So there’s this divine dance and this play going on And this isn’t new to us. We just have more awareness of all the puzzle pieces. This thing between good and evil, light and dark.

All this whole thing is intrinsic to the, to the experience of creation, right? 

Dr. Gabriel Cousens: To the human condition. 

Ronnie Landis: Yeah. 

Dr. Gabriel Cousens: Yeah. And it’s, it’s, it’s, it is that you say we’re some best, we want the best. And that’s why we do what we’re doing. And the diet we’re talking about is about the best. But again, It has to be the best for what, and that’s keeping our focus on the truth, and living in the truth the best we can, and when we’re healthy, we can best do it.

Maimonides? That great medieval physician, Rabbi, uh, 11, uh, 30 to, um, 1204, he said it this way, to maintain the welfare of the soul, we must focus on the welfare of the body. That’s what we’re talking about. That kind of sums it up. 

Not a new 

idea, in other words. Not a new idea. 

Ronnie Landis: Yeah, that’s uh, wow. Yeah, there’s I mean, it’s an endless amount of insights and and um wisdom rabbit holes that I I would love to indulge in obviously we have Um, we have time constraints and I know you are an extremely busy man on a mission that never ends But with everything that we’ve talked about in this conversation, dr.

Cousins Is there any parting insights that you would like to share, um, to wrap up our conversation? 

Dr. Gabriel Cousens: The most important advice is for people to, to remember that we are the truth of God unfolding on this planet. And really to believe in the deepest level of who we are and be willing to follow it for upliftment of not only our soul, but the upliftment of the soul of humanity.

I’m in. Oh, good. Thank you, Austin. Good. 

Ronnie Landis: Thank you so much. This has been an absolute delight and pleasure and honor. And before we wrap up, where can everybody find your work, your, um, the tree of life. Healing center in Patagonia, Arizona, if they feel inclined to visit or any other maybe projects or things that you have coming up.

Dr. Gabriel Cousens: So that’s a good question. So then people can find me at drcousins. com. I’ve made a major shift, which I knew I was going to do 25 years ago, uh, which is I have, uh, 17 different programs around the world in humanitarian programs and organic, veganic, diabetes prevention, a lot of things, you know, global level countries.

And I’m putting a lot of energy there. And I’m also putting energy back into what I call whole person healings. People come, spend two and a half, three hours with me, and I really get a, everything we’re talking about. I help people get a game plan together on physical, emotional, mental, and spiritual levels.

So that’s kind of opening up right now. So I’m seeing more and more people like that. And I’m free to do my other work. I just got back from Brazil, um, where we’re setting up things, all, I mean, there’s Sao Paulo, there’s a hundred, there’s 30 million people, you know, and so we’re doing diabetes prevention, we’re doing holistic veganism, we’re bringing that to the whole country.

It’s spoken Brazilian, Sao Paulo. So I’m around the world doing that. And then I’m here, Doing the whole person healings and we are still really activating the scene gathering Which is happening in the I think the second week in september Where we bring all these energies together and and and collectively talk and meet and plan and think what we’re doing Um, you know, i’ll actually send you the exact date.

I think it’s september 12th or something like that But basically my my world mission is beginning. I’m supporting it with whole person healings If you see what I’m saying, um, and we expect to seriously expand this year into more countries, uh, uh, around the world. We’re doing a lot of work in Africa, but also, as I said, Brazil and Mexico and lots of places.

So, uh, the more we can get supported, the more people can get the advantage of the whole person healing. And of the spiritual teaching, because I’m on Facebook, like, three times a week, doing that, you know, getting the message out. The idea is, get the message out, but also empower people. So, I bless you, and I really bless all the listeners that they’re able to take this and really be empowered to make those changes in their life, to reconnect to their sacred desire, and reconnect to that desire for the divine.

That’s the big blessing. That’s really our world mission. Okay, 

Ronnie Landis: really? I, uh, so much to be said. But really, it’s, um, yeah, it’s just a really, it’s a big honor. I just feel so much gratitude and appreciation for you and and really what I want to want to just finalize on my note. To you, sir, is I’m just so inspired at 32 years young, 32 going on to 50.

Dr. Gabriel Cousens: Yeah, you have a lot of wisdom. You ask really good questions. I like that. I like that a lot. 

Ronnie Landis: Thank you. And I just really appreciate. Pioneers and, um, way showers such as yourself that, um, that are just still going strong, you know, and still improving and still learning and still enlightening yourself and showing the way, um, when a lot of people could just live comfortably, they could just retire.

And, and, and stop the whole thing. But you are, you are being on a mission and that just inspires me to never give up and to never succumb to mediocrity and just keep moving. Right. And so thank you for that. 

Dr. Gabriel Cousens: Well, thank you for, uh, give me that feedback. Obviously, I have no plans to stop. I just plan to keep getting stronger and stronger in this whole thing.

So, you know, that’s it. That’s what we do. You know, that’s the football part, right? Yes. Yeah. 

Ronnie Landis: Winner. Yeah. Well, thank you so much, Dr. Cousins. And for everyone listening, Make sure that you take a look at Dr. Cousins information. If you haven’t already, he has some absolutely seminal works on all of the subject and so much more in his books.

Um, I’ve read many of them, absolutely foundational, um, education. And then also make sure that you, you like Dr. Cousins, um, Facebook page, because as he alluded to, he’s doing a lot of, a lot of educational work to go deeper into a lot of these topics of enlightenment and Full person healing as, as you put it, Dr.

Cousins. So everyone makes sure that you like his Facebook page so you can stay updated on everything that he’s doing. 

Dr. Gabriel Cousens: Super. Thank you. It’s a joy to share with you. You’re really doing well. Thank you. 

Ronnie Landis: Thank you so much.

I hope you enjoyed this fascinating episode of the Holistic Health and Human Potential show. Before you head off, I want to invite you to go to my website for further podcast episodes and tons of free content on holistic health, natural nutrition, and human potential. Please go to www. ronnielandis. net to find out how to take your health and your life to the next level.

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